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	<title>Comments on: This is one reason we hate the uber-wealthy</title>
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	<link>https://habitablezone.com/2011/06/19/this-is-one-reason-we-hate-the-uber-wealthy/</link>
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		<title>By: Eri</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2011/06/19/this-is-one-reason-we-hate-the-uber-wealthy/#comment-2551</link>
		<dc:creator>Eri</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Jun 2011 05:26:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=1846#comment-2551</guid>
		<description>Where I draw the line is ostentatious wealth that serves no purpose.  I don&#039;t/wouldn&#039;t deny people their luxuries.  I would enjoy some myself if I were wealthy but I&#039;d be damn sure a lot of the money went to help people.  I wouldn&#039;t be buying Marilyn Monroe&#039;s gowns for over a million $$.  I wouldn&#039;t buy a Monet painting even though I absolutely love his work and would love to have one of his paintings on my wall.  A living painter, I might buy because that goes to feed the artist and that artist will spend the money.

But when you spend a mill for a dress, the person to whom that money goes will not necessarily spread it around.  You can&#039;t guarantee that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where I draw the line is ostentatious wealth that serves no purpose.  I don&#8217;t/wouldn&#8217;t deny people their luxuries.  I would enjoy some myself if I were wealthy but I&#8217;d be damn sure a lot of the money went to help people.  I wouldn&#8217;t be buying Marilyn Monroe&#8217;s gowns for over a million $$.  I wouldn&#8217;t buy a Monet painting even though I absolutely love his work and would love to have one of his paintings on my wall.  A living painter, I might buy because that goes to feed the artist and that artist will spend the money.</p>
<p>But when you spend a mill for a dress, the person to whom that money goes will not necessarily spread it around.  You can&#8217;t guarantee that.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2011/06/19/this-is-one-reason-we-hate-the-uber-wealthy/#comment-2549</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Jun 2011 04:09:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=1846#comment-2549</guid>
		<description>I see where you&#039;re coming from, but where do you draw the line?  If I choose to live in a modest house (as opposed to a barely habitable tenement in a slum) am I spending too much selfishly on myself?  Should I feel guilty because I treated myself to a nice pair of binoculars instead of donating my money to the poor?
It&#039;s always relative, one man&#039;s luxury is another man&#039;s necessity.  

Should I buy a book at the bookstore or check it out for free from the library? Of course, the library is not free either, it is paid for by the state, and ultimately, our taxes.  Should anyone feel guilty because they read for free at the public&#039;s expense?  I can afford to buy my own books, and I often do, but I still support libraries, and I often patronize them.  And I do not complain my taxes go to support them. People who can afford their own books have an obligation to help provide books for those who cannot.  If that&#039;s socialism, then tough shit, jack.

Where I draw the line is not so much in the value of a possession or property, but in the manipulation of income generating property.  If I rent a house to someone, I do him a favor, I deserve to get paid and even to profit, because I provide that person with a vital service, an essential commodity.  But there is something systemically wrong with a system where foreclosed houses are empty while hordes of homeless walk the streets.

No, I don&#039;t know how to solve that problem, but I&#039;m not pretending there isn&#039;t one, either. Stealing from the rich to give to the poor is not the answer, but the rich sometimes DO steal from the poor. There isn&#039;t the slightest doubt in my mind of that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I see where you&#8217;re coming from, but where do you draw the line?  If I choose to live in a modest house (as opposed to a barely habitable tenement in a slum) am I spending too much selfishly on myself?  Should I feel guilty because I treated myself to a nice pair of binoculars instead of donating my money to the poor?<br />
It&#8217;s always relative, one man&#8217;s luxury is another man&#8217;s necessity.  </p>
<p>Should I buy a book at the bookstore or check it out for free from the library? Of course, the library is not free either, it is paid for by the state, and ultimately, our taxes.  Should anyone feel guilty because they read for free at the public&#8217;s expense?  I can afford to buy my own books, and I often do, but I still support libraries, and I often patronize them.  And I do not complain my taxes go to support them. People who can afford their own books have an obligation to help provide books for those who cannot.  If that&#8217;s socialism, then tough shit, jack.</p>
<p>Where I draw the line is not so much in the value of a possession or property, but in the manipulation of income generating property.  If I rent a house to someone, I do him a favor, I deserve to get paid and even to profit, because I provide that person with a vital service, an essential commodity.  But there is something systemically wrong with a system where foreclosed houses are empty while hordes of homeless walk the streets.</p>
<p>No, I don&#8217;t know how to solve that problem, but I&#8217;m not pretending there isn&#8217;t one, either. Stealing from the rich to give to the poor is not the answer, but the rich sometimes DO steal from the poor. There isn&#8217;t the slightest doubt in my mind of that.</p>
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		<title>By: mcfly</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2011/06/19/this-is-one-reason-we-hate-the-uber-wealthy/#comment-2545</link>
		<dc:creator>mcfly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Jun 2011 00:59:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=1846#comment-2545</guid>
		<description>I know what you&#039;re saying. It can be terribly aggravating, the sense that money that could be doing good for people is being squandered.

But  long and the short of it is that it&#039;s their money, to use as they see fit.

Remember that spent money isn&#039;t burned and nullified, but rather becomes purchasing power for someone else. The millions spent on that dress becomes take-home pay for who-knows-how-many people; it gets pressed into service buying food and paying rent and continues to spread out from there.

At the risk of putting myself into stark agreement with TB, the fact is that countries where people are able to generate and exploit wealth are far better places to live than countries where the creation of wealth has been stifled.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know what you&#8217;re saying. It can be terribly aggravating, the sense that money that could be doing good for people is being squandered.</p>
<p>But  long and the short of it is that it&#8217;s their money, to use as they see fit.</p>
<p>Remember that spent money isn&#8217;t burned and nullified, but rather becomes purchasing power for someone else. The millions spent on that dress becomes take-home pay for who-knows-how-many people; it gets pressed into service buying food and paying rent and continues to spread out from there.</p>
<p>At the risk of putting myself into stark agreement with TB, the fact is that countries where people are able to generate and exploit wealth are far better places to live than countries where the creation of wealth has been stifled.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2011/06/19/this-is-one-reason-we-hate-the-uber-wealthy/#comment-2539</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Jun 2011 20:30:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=1846#comment-2539</guid>
		<description>When we first moved to California, we drove out of the Sierras near Monterey and took a little side trip to Pebble Beach, a place where I had done some tidepooling years earlier during my obligatory undergraduate Grand Tour of the continent.  Mme Reclus wanted to see &quot;17 Mile Drive&quot;, which was just a label on a map to me, I had never been there before (or maybe just didn&#039;t remember it) and had no idea what it was.  We paid our toll and took the tour, and I remarked to her, &quot;My God, look at all these fancy resorts and hotels.&quot;  What are these places, country clubs for just one golf course?&quot;

&quot;Non, mon cher&quot;,  she replied, &quot; Those are not hotels.  Those are private residences.  People actually live here.&quot;  

I was astonished, flabbergasted.  &quot;Then what was that block of apartments we just passed back there?&quot;

&quot;Oh those,&quot; she laughed.  &quot;that&#039;s probably where the help stays. I suppose they have to quarter the staff somewhere&quot;

I was outraged.  &quot;No one deserves to live like that until everyone is able to live like that.&quot;

&quot;Don&#039;t say that.&quot; she replied, half seriously. &quot;I wouldn&#039;t mind living that way myself, some day. We don&#039;t want to do anything that might jinx it for us.&quot;

Then suddenly it struck me.  It&#039;s not really the rich that constantly works and strives and pushes for the aristocratic life style.  The rich already have it, they are used to it, it&#039;s really no big deal for them.  They even enjoy slumming it every now and then. They feel it is their birthright, perhaps not intellectually, but deep down, emotionally. And I think that they know its unsustainable and are even resigned to losing it.

 No, it&#039;s the middle class that works and strives for the life of extreme riches and luxury, who are terrified they&#039;ll miss their chance at it.  They feel they work for it so they deserve it, not those rich &quot;elites&quot; that inherit everything, or the poor who want everything &quot;handed to them on a silver platter&quot; but aren&#039;t willing to work for anything. The middle class, and not the rich, are the ones who defend it publicly and work for it, who plot and scheme for it politically, who fear that maybe they won&#039;t get their piece of the action. See how they bravely defend the right they fear they may never earn. The rich either already have inherited it, or they are working too hard to maintain it, or have resigned themselves to giving it up. They know better than to attract attention to themselves that way, they keep a low profile.  They remember Louis XVI and Marie-Antoinette and all that unpleasantness in 1789.

&quot;So, what would you do with all these mansions if you were in charge, my dear?&quot;  jybed my wife, obviously trying to provoke me into one of my rants.

&quot;I&#039;d turn some into drug rehab centers and day care for the kids of the staff that worked there. And I&#039;d build a Marine Institute here and turn some into labs and classrooms and student housing.  And some I&#039;d turn into hotels and resorts so everyone would have a chance to see what it was like to live like this. And I sure as hell wouldn&#039;t charge people a toll to drive through here.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When we first moved to California, we drove out of the Sierras near Monterey and took a little side trip to Pebble Beach, a place where I had done some tidepooling years earlier during my obligatory undergraduate Grand Tour of the continent.  Mme Reclus wanted to see &#8220;17 Mile Drive&#8221;, which was just a label on a map to me, I had never been there before (or maybe just didn&#8217;t remember it) and had no idea what it was.  We paid our toll and took the tour, and I remarked to her, &#8220;My God, look at all these fancy resorts and hotels.&#8221;  What are these places, country clubs for just one golf course?&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Non, mon cher&#8221;,  she replied, &#8221; Those are not hotels.  Those are private residences.  People actually live here.&#8221;  </p>
<p>I was astonished, flabbergasted.  &#8220;Then what was that block of apartments we just passed back there?&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Oh those,&#8221; she laughed.  &#8220;that&#8217;s probably where the help stays. I suppose they have to quarter the staff somewhere&#8221;</p>
<p>I was outraged.  &#8220;No one deserves to live like that until everyone is able to live like that.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Don&#8217;t say that.&#8221; she replied, half seriously. &#8220;I wouldn&#8217;t mind living that way myself, some day. We don&#8217;t want to do anything that might jinx it for us.&#8221;</p>
<p>Then suddenly it struck me.  It&#8217;s not really the rich that constantly works and strives and pushes for the aristocratic life style.  The rich already have it, they are used to it, it&#8217;s really no big deal for them.  They even enjoy slumming it every now and then. They feel it is their birthright, perhaps not intellectually, but deep down, emotionally. And I think that they know its unsustainable and are even resigned to losing it.</p>
<p> No, it&#8217;s the middle class that works and strives for the life of extreme riches and luxury, who are terrified they&#8217;ll miss their chance at it.  They feel they work for it so they deserve it, not those rich &#8220;elites&#8221; that inherit everything, or the poor who want everything &#8220;handed to them on a silver platter&#8221; but aren&#8217;t willing to work for anything. The middle class, and not the rich, are the ones who defend it publicly and work for it, who plot and scheme for it politically, who fear that maybe they won&#8217;t get their piece of the action. See how they bravely defend the right they fear they may never earn. The rich either already have inherited it, or they are working too hard to maintain it, or have resigned themselves to giving it up. They know better than to attract attention to themselves that way, they keep a low profile.  They remember Louis XVI and Marie-Antoinette and all that unpleasantness in 1789.</p>
<p>&#8220;So, what would you do with all these mansions if you were in charge, my dear?&#8221;  jybed my wife, obviously trying to provoke me into one of my rants.</p>
<p>&#8220;I&#8217;d turn some into drug rehab centers and day care for the kids of the staff that worked there. And I&#8217;d build a Marine Institute here and turn some into labs and classrooms and student housing.  And some I&#8217;d turn into hotels and resorts so everyone would have a chance to see what it was like to live like this. And I sure as hell wouldn&#8217;t charge people a toll to drive through here.&#8221;</p>
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