Comments on: Photos from the Battle of the Bulge https://habitablezone.com/2011/12/18/photos-from-the-battle-of-the-bulge/ Mon, 06 Apr 2026 12:03:37 -0700 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: bowser https://habitablezone.com/2011/12/18/photos-from-the-battle-of-the-bulge/#comment-9687 bowser Tue, 20 Dec 2011 04:07:02 +0000 http://habitablezone.com/?p=6021#comment-9687 American ground strategies since the Civil War have been willing to take massive casualties. Infantrymen are sacrificed rather than take time to plan and execute more conservative maneuvers. In WWII faster frontal assaults were preferred, as the same situation applied as did in WWI and the Civil War. The enemy had limited manpower, the US virtually unlimited. The South Pacific invasions were often poorly planned, with many landing craft becoming stranded 600 or 700 yards off the beach. People were forced to wade through the water and machine gun fire simply to get ashore. Even though it was a slaughter, some made it and the powers that be regarded those losses as acceptable. American Generals had problems with Montgomery's deliberateness in WW II. The British had only so many people available, and he tried to conserve lives. The US didn't care, despite what one would like to believe. The revered Patton made his reputation over the bodies of people killed in reckless operations, regarded casualties as irrelevant. The PR a General could command during combat precluded anything but favorable information getting out. In Vietnam units would be chewed up attacking an position, generally a hill, win it, then retreat. After a while they would be sent up it again, get thoroughly chewed up, and retreat again. The idea was to attrit the enemy, if the numbers were truly honest would show that those attacks were not effective. And, we'll never know the numbers. American ground strategies since the Civil War have been willing to take massive casualties. Infantrymen are sacrificed rather than take time to plan and execute more conservative maneuvers. In WWII faster frontal assaults were preferred, as the same situation applied as did in WWI and the Civil War. The enemy had limited manpower, the US virtually unlimited.

The South Pacific invasions were often poorly planned, with many landing craft becoming stranded 600 or 700 yards off the beach. People were forced to wade through the water and machine gun fire simply to get ashore. Even though it was a slaughter, some made it and the powers that be regarded those losses as acceptable.

American Generals had problems with Montgomery’s deliberateness in WW II. The British had only so many people available, and he tried to conserve lives. The US didn’t care, despite what one would like to believe. The revered Patton made his reputation over the bodies of people killed in reckless operations, regarded casualties as irrelevant. The PR a General could command during combat precluded anything but favorable information getting out.

In Vietnam units would be chewed up attacking an position, generally a hill, win it, then retreat. After a while they would be sent up it again, get thoroughly chewed up, and retreat again. The idea was to attrit the enemy, if the numbers were truly honest would show that those attacks were not effective. And, we’ll never know the numbers.

]]> By: VelociraptorBlade https://habitablezone.com/2011/12/18/photos-from-the-battle-of-the-bulge/#comment-9667 VelociraptorBlade Tue, 20 Dec 2011 02:02:23 +0000 http://habitablezone.com/?p=6021#comment-9667 Yikes..... 350%? That sounds hellish. Also, I've looked at those photos and the color ones scare the crap out of me. Not because they "seem more tealistic", but because they don't seem to elicit the same response of concern as the black and white ones do. I look at them and... they don't seem that distant or alien. They look like the stuff you see on CNN, or BBC, or internet news sites, or any source of media. It looks less like something that happened over 60 years ago and looks more like something that happened in the past 60 days. I don't know if it's the frequent amount of wars around the globe in my generation, or if it's the contrast of black and white colors and how we've grown more used to them in the second half of the 20th Century, but....... Me and others around me have grown up with seeing and reading this stuff from different news media. The prospect of war just doesn't seem to affect me or others my age as much as it would affect someone our ages those many years ago. That scares me. That scares me a LOT. Yikes….. 350%? That sounds hellish.
Also, I’ve looked at those photos and the color ones scare the crap out of me. Not because they “seem more tealistic”, but because they don’t seem to elicit the same response of concern as the black and white ones do. I look at them and… they don’t seem that distant or alien. They look like the stuff you see on CNN, or BBC, or internet news sites, or any source of media. It looks less like something that happened over 60 years ago and looks more like something that happened in the past 60 days. I don’t know if it’s the frequent amount of wars around the globe in my generation, or if it’s the contrast of black and white colors and how we’ve grown more used to them in the second half of the 20th Century, but…….

Me and others around me have grown up with seeing and reading this stuff from different news media. The prospect of war just doesn’t seem to affect me or others my age as much as it would affect someone our ages those many years ago. That scares me. That scares me a LOT.

]]> By: bowser https://habitablezone.com/2011/12/18/photos-from-the-battle-of-the-bulge/#comment-9662 bowser Mon, 19 Dec 2011 23:29:53 +0000 http://habitablezone.com/?p=6021#comment-9662 The longest conversation I've had with someone who was in the Winter campaign of '44 - '45 was with a retired college professor who had been a company commander through the entire thing. He said his company's casualties were 350%, most due to things like frostbite. With the exception of occasional 1 day reprieves to go back and get a hot meal and shower, they were left in the line the entire time. I questioned the 350% casualty rate, asking why anyone would accept that for a unit, asked why it wasn't rotated out, there must be some reserves. He said part of the reason was that everyone expected Germany to collapse any time, another part was that everything was being used. That is one brutal process, and I can't imagine what it may have been like for an infantryman to be stuck out in that snow, ice and cold for what was probably the rest of your life. The professor said that college graduates seemed to have a better chance of survival than others, and that while it didn't make any sense to him that was his experience. The longest conversation I’ve had with someone who was in the Winter campaign of ’44 – ’45 was with a retired college professor who had been a company commander through the entire thing.

He said his company’s casualties were 350%, most due to things like frostbite. With the exception of occasional 1 day reprieves to go back and get a hot meal and shower, they were left in the line the entire time.

I questioned the 350% casualty rate, asking why anyone would accept that for a unit, asked why it wasn’t rotated out, there must be some reserves.

He said part of the reason was that everyone expected Germany to collapse any time, another part was that everything was being used.

That is one brutal process, and I can’t imagine what it may have been like for an infantryman to be stuck out in that snow, ice and cold for what was probably the rest of your life.

The professor said that college graduates seemed to have a better chance of survival than others, and that while it didn’t make any sense to him that was his experience.

]]> By: ER https://habitablezone.com/2011/12/18/photos-from-the-battle-of-the-bulge/#comment-9651 ER Mon, 19 Dec 2011 11:33:00 +0000 http://habitablezone.com/?p=6021#comment-9651 Most of the people who were there were probably nice guys. Even the Germans. Most of the people who were there were probably nice guys. Even the Germans.

]]> By: bowser https://habitablezone.com/2011/12/18/photos-from-the-battle-of-the-bulge/#comment-9644 bowser Mon, 19 Dec 2011 05:55:10 +0000 http://habitablezone.com/?p=6021#comment-9644 I've known a few people who were there, more or less well. Even with time not one of them had anything good to say about it. They were proud to have been there, proud of the "Nuts" response, but not one of them would have volunteered for the experience. I may not have met a representative cross-section, but they were all nice guys I’ve known a few people who were there, more or less well. Even with time not one of them had anything good to say about it.

They were proud to have been there, proud of the “Nuts” response, but not one of them would have volunteered for the experience.

I may not have met a representative cross-section, but they were all nice guys

]]>