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	<title>Comments on: China builds special factory, has skilled workers the US can&#8217;t match.  For US job.</title>
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	<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/</link>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15703</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2012 16:07:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15703</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve done that. A thread starts with the context set by the root post, but then we branch off, and I&#039;ve found myself responding to the thread overall instead of to a specific comment. I tend to assume that somebody isn&#039;t changing the subject, but is using the digression to make a point related to the main point, so returning to the thread topic can make sense. Except when it doesn&#039;t.

This format can be confusing like that sometimes. If we didn&#039;t have the thread tree, we could live in an Alzheimer&#039;s moment in which the context was no more than the last post. But the tree imposes a duality, literally seeing the forest and the trees at the same time.

It did seem a little strange that you weren&#039;t seeing the context problem. But it sounds like you were working a higher context, so to speak. I can see how that could confuse things.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve done that. A thread starts with the context set by the root post, but then we branch off, and I&#8217;ve found myself responding to the thread overall instead of to a specific comment. I tend to assume that somebody isn&#8217;t changing the subject, but is using the digression to make a point related to the main point, so returning to the thread topic can make sense. Except when it doesn&#8217;t.</p>
<p>This format can be confusing like that sometimes. If we didn&#8217;t have the thread tree, we could live in an Alzheimer&#8217;s moment in which the context was no more than the last post. But the tree imposes a duality, literally seeing the forest and the trees at the same time.</p>
<p>It did seem a little strange that you weren&#8217;t seeing the context problem. But it sounds like you were working a higher context, so to speak. I can see how that could confuse things.</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15702</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2012 15:22:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15702</guid>
		<description>PS. It was in the context of US steel competing with Chinese labor. n/t</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PS. It was in the context of US steel competing with Chinese labor. n/t</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15701</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2012 15:12:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15701</guid>
		<description>Just a fly in the ointment then.  n/t</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a fly in the ointment then.  n/t</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15694</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jun 2012 20:09:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15694</guid>
		<description>It seems pretty straightforward. Any work like that history makes lots of statements that, taken together, when you&#039;re done reading, amount to a conclusion. If you take just one of those statements in isolation and it leads to a conclusion opposite to the one you&#039;d have come to taking all the statements into consideration, you&#039;ve taken that statement out of context.

The history of Bethlehem Steel is overwhelmingly about the excesses and abuses of management. The thread about Bethlehem&#039;s labor relations emphasized countless times the brutal conditions and low pay of Bethlehem workers. The history was in no conceivable way trying to make the point that unions killed Bethelehem.

It was around 1959 that the workers started to turn things around, but even then the history pointed out that management, thinking it could ride the gravy train forever and that it could raise prices any amount to cover labor costs, made a number of foolish agreements with the union. The most notable one was Clause 2B, which was essentially the Featherbedding Forever clause. It&#039;s interesting to note that the one sentence you took was from that section, and it was about &lt;i&gt;future&lt;/i&gt; benefits for which the Clause 2b negotiations set the precedent. 13-week vacations and &quot;UN Day&quot; were still in the far future and had nothing to do with the events described in the history.

In other words, that sentence was doubly out of context, being not only inconsistent with the whole story, but not even a part of the story. 

That&#039;s a serious context deficit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It seems pretty straightforward. Any work like that history makes lots of statements that, taken together, when you&#8217;re done reading, amount to a conclusion. If you take just one of those statements in isolation and it leads to a conclusion opposite to the one you&#8217;d have come to taking all the statements into consideration, you&#8217;ve taken that statement out of context.</p>
<p>The history of Bethlehem Steel is overwhelmingly about the excesses and abuses of management. The thread about Bethlehem&#8217;s labor relations emphasized countless times the brutal conditions and low pay of Bethlehem workers. The history was in no conceivable way trying to make the point that unions killed Bethelehem.</p>
<p>It was around 1959 that the workers started to turn things around, but even then the history pointed out that management, thinking it could ride the gravy train forever and that it could raise prices any amount to cover labor costs, made a number of foolish agreements with the union. The most notable one was Clause 2B, which was essentially the Featherbedding Forever clause. It&#8217;s interesting to note that the one sentence you took was from that section, and it was about <i>future</i> benefits for which the Clause 2b negotiations set the precedent. 13-week vacations and &#8220;UN Day&#8221; were still in the far future and had nothing to do with the events described in the history.</p>
<p>In other words, that sentence was doubly out of context, being not only inconsistent with the whole story, but not even a part of the story. </p>
<p>That&#8217;s a serious context deficit.</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15691</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jun 2012 14:54:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15691</guid>
		<description>Taking a factual statement from a body of information is not like taking a &lt;u&gt;quote&lt;/u&gt; out of context to distort it&#039;s meaning.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Taking a factual statement from a body of information is not like taking a <u>quote</u> out of context to distort it&#8217;s meaning.</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15622</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2012 14:39:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15622</guid>
		<description>I would say something taken out of context loses definition. Not the case here. n/t  </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would say something taken out of context loses definition. Not the case here. n/t</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15615</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2012 04:58:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15615</guid>
		<description>Well, that&#039;s kinda the definition of &quot;out of context&quot;, isn&#039;t it?   n/t</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, that&#8217;s kinda the definition of &#8220;out of context&#8221;, isn&#8217;t it?   n/t</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15613</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2012 04:15:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15613</guid>
		<description>Out of context? Pretty much stands alone in my opinion.  n/t</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Out of context? Pretty much stands alone in my opinion.  n/t</p>
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		<title>By: bowser</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15612</link>
		<dc:creator>bowser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jun 2012 01:14:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15612</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s OK.  We know it, and you can be honest about it.  Shifting metaphors, your dances of the Seven Veils aren&#039;t sexy when the veils are transparent.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s OK.  We know it, and you can be honest about it.  Shifting metaphors, your dances of the Seven Veils aren&#8217;t sexy when the veils are transparent.</p>
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		<title>By: TB</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2012/06/05/china-builds-special-factory-has-skilled-workers-the-us-cant-match-for-us-job/#comment-15610</link>
		<dc:creator>TB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2012 23:26:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.habitablezone.com/?p=16110#comment-15610</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The good news is that people are building smaller and better versions of the Saturn V.&lt;/p&gt;

I did a little contract work for a company that bragged about how they had brought in a lot of &quot;old hands&quot; from the Apollo program.  The problem is they came with a lot of old ideas, too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The good news is that people are building smaller and better versions of the Saturn V.</p>
<p>I did a little contract work for a company that bragged about how they had brought in a lot of &#8220;old hands&#8221; from the Apollo program.  The problem is they came with a lot of old ideas, too.</p>
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