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	<title>Comments on: Get a job, longhair.</title>
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	<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/</link>
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		<title>By: TB</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24797</link>
		<dc:creator>TB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Jul 2013 01:59:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24797</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The actual problem:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;img src=&quot;http://habitablezone.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/College_Tuition_Costs.jpg&quot; alt=&quot;&quot; /&gt;

You might note that it&#039;s not the students who are sucking up the subsidies here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The actual problem:</p>
<p><img src="http://habitablezone.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/College_Tuition_Costs.jpg" alt="" /></p>
<p>You might note that it&#8217;s not the students who are sucking up the subsidies here.</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24791</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jul 2013 23:47:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24791</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t understand. n/t</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t understand. n/t</p>
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		<title>By: alcaray</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24787</link>
		<dc:creator>alcaray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jul 2013 05:37:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24787</guid>
		<description>Ah.  Like removing car safety regulations will cause people to become better drivers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah.  Like removing car safety regulations will cause people to become better drivers.</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24783</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jul 2013 04:06:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24783</guid>
		<description>I lived at home for 2 years while going to CC. The tuition was less than half that of the U. I worked precision sheet metal all summer, every summer.  

I only had to borrow $2500 my senior year. Tuition was $4800 per year and books about $700.

In current dollars the tuition would be almost $12,000 and the loan $6000.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I lived at home for 2 years while going to CC. The tuition was less than half that of the U. I worked precision sheet metal all summer, every summer.  </p>
<p>I only had to borrow $2500 my senior year. Tuition was $4800 per year and books about $700.</p>
<p>In current dollars the tuition would be almost $12,000 and the loan $6000.</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24781</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jul 2013 03:44:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24781</guid>
		<description>The theory was that salaries would increase by the time the higher rates kicked. It was wishful thinking.

The recession started with round after round of foreclosures, the people with ARMS had been forced to default because the couldn&#039;t handle the higher monthly payments.

I&#039;m not saying education financing is bad or wrong, but I am saying that loaning money to people who are going to have a hard time paying it back is unwise at the least. There has been plenty of news stories lately about students who&#039;s projected income doesn&#039;t justify the borrowing for their schooling. 

It makes about as much sense as loaning money to a small start-up business that doesn&#039;t have a business plan. 

There needs to be mechanisms to protect against follies.The interest rate is one such mechanism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The theory was that salaries would increase by the time the higher rates kicked. It was wishful thinking.</p>
<p>The recession started with round after round of foreclosures, the people with ARMS had been forced to default because the couldn&#8217;t handle the higher monthly payments.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not saying education financing is bad or wrong, but I am saying that loaning money to people who are going to have a hard time paying it back is unwise at the least. There has been plenty of news stories lately about students who&#8217;s projected income doesn&#8217;t justify the borrowing for their schooling. </p>
<p>It makes about as much sense as loaning money to a small start-up business that doesn&#8217;t have a business plan. </p>
<p>There needs to be mechanisms to protect against follies.The interest rate is one such mechanism.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24773</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Jul 2013 21:21:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24773</guid>
		<description>Farmers as a rule vote Republican and have strong Conservative views.

But when the Soviets wanted to buy up a good piece of our grain harvest, they not only backed it, they also lobbied for providing the Reds with financing to allow them to do it in style.

It is only natural for people, not just Conservatives, to modulate their principles in order to make them coincide with their interests.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Farmers as a rule vote Republican and have strong Conservative views.</p>
<p>But when the Soviets wanted to buy up a good piece of our grain harvest, they not only backed it, they also lobbied for providing the Reds with financing to allow them to do it in style.</p>
<p>It is only natural for people, not just Conservatives, to modulate their principles in order to make them coincide with their interests.</p>
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		<title>By: bowser</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24769</link>
		<dc:creator>bowser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Jul 2013 20:41:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24769</guid>
		<description>Every social program is a boon for private businesses.  The weak, poor and helpless may receive the fruits of these programs, but who provides those fruits?  Who grows the food paid for with food stamps?  Who makes money selling the beans to the people with food stamps?

As a rule, very large businesses.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Every social program is a boon for private businesses.  The weak, poor and helpless may receive the fruits of these programs, but who provides those fruits?  Who grows the food paid for with food stamps?  Who makes money selling the beans to the people with food stamps?</p>
<p>As a rule, very large businesses.</p>
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		<title>By: bowser</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24768</link>
		<dc:creator>bowser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Jul 2013 20:38:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24768</guid>
		<description>As you point out very well, this is a middle-class subsidy.  And you also point out it is in the national interest that the middle-class be trained to be the technicians every advanced nation needs.

These people will not come from anywhere other than the middle class, which cannot as a rule afford to pay for their education.  The nation purchases tanks, missiles, ships, and rockets from companies because it perceives a need for these items.  There is no reason it should not pay for the education of its&#039; citizens as it perceives a need for these trained people.

Every cut in social programs is permanent.  Things will never get better as globalization proceeds, and other countries become more technically proficient, mostly by educating their citizenry.  For all his faults, Ghadafi provided as much education for Libyans as they wanted, the state paying for it all.

If the US is serious about cutting back spending, it could cut the military budget in half without degrading the security of our country.  When that happens I&#039;ll believe Conservatives are serious about saving money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As you point out very well, this is a middle-class subsidy.  And you also point out it is in the national interest that the middle-class be trained to be the technicians every advanced nation needs.</p>
<p>These people will not come from anywhere other than the middle class, which cannot as a rule afford to pay for their education.  The nation purchases tanks, missiles, ships, and rockets from companies because it perceives a need for these items.  There is no reason it should not pay for the education of its&#8217; citizens as it perceives a need for these trained people.</p>
<p>Every cut in social programs is permanent.  Things will never get better as globalization proceeds, and other countries become more technically proficient, mostly by educating their citizenry.  For all his faults, Ghadafi provided as much education for Libyans as they wanted, the state paying for it all.</p>
<p>If the US is serious about cutting back spending, it could cut the military budget in half without degrading the security of our country.  When that happens I&#8217;ll believe Conservatives are serious about saving money.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24764</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Jul 2013 17:28:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24764</guid>
		<description>If I had had to borrow to go, I would have not gone.  I used my father&#039;s unused GI Bill and lived at home my first 2 years, and then I worked part-time and used my own GI Bill for the last 3 after I came back from the service. But in those days, USF tuition for a FL resident not living on campus was about $200/quarter.  My GI Bill was about $200/mo. Books and living expenses were my responsibility. Of course, that was a lot of money in the late 60s. (A brand new VW Beetle cost $1800). As for living expenses,  I rode a bicycle, had roommates, and lived in a dump so grungy that once City thought it was an abandoned building and they mowed our yard. Still, I had more fun those 3 years than I have ever had, before or since.

I remember thinking at the time it was a fair arrangement and I was very happy with it.  Of course, if I had had a mortgage or a family it would have been impossible.

Even in those countries where college is &quot;free&quot;, only tuition is covered by the State. Books, fees and other expenses are the student&#039;s responsibility. My grandfather attended the University of Havana Med School in the early years of the 20th century (until he was thrown out for radical politics), and he relied on help from his parents even though his tuition was covered by the government.  As in most civilized countries, if you are able to pass the entrance exams, the State has the obligation to pay for at least your tuition.

Actually, we have the same system here because tuition does not cover the cost of an education.  Only here, the government subsidizes those people who can already afford the tuition.  This is why I like to call it a form of middle-class welfare.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If I had had to borrow to go, I would have not gone.  I used my father&#8217;s unused GI Bill and lived at home my first 2 years, and then I worked part-time and used my own GI Bill for the last 3 after I came back from the service. But in those days, USF tuition for a FL resident not living on campus was about $200/quarter.  My GI Bill was about $200/mo. Books and living expenses were my responsibility. Of course, that was a lot of money in the late 60s. (A brand new VW Beetle cost $1800). As for living expenses,  I rode a bicycle, had roommates, and lived in a dump so grungy that once City thought it was an abandoned building and they mowed our yard. Still, I had more fun those 3 years than I have ever had, before or since.</p>
<p>I remember thinking at the time it was a fair arrangement and I was very happy with it.  Of course, if I had had a mortgage or a family it would have been impossible.</p>
<p>Even in those countries where college is &#8220;free&#8221;, only tuition is covered by the State. Books, fees and other expenses are the student&#8217;s responsibility. My grandfather attended the University of Havana Med School in the early years of the 20th century (until he was thrown out for radical politics), and he relied on help from his parents even though his tuition was covered by the government.  As in most civilized countries, if you are able to pass the entrance exams, the State has the obligation to pay for at least your tuition.</p>
<p>Actually, we have the same system here because tuition does not cover the cost of an education.  Only here, the government subsidizes those people who can already afford the tuition.  This is why I like to call it a form of middle-class welfare.</p>
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		<title>By: alcaray</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2013/07/01/get-a-job-longhair/#comment-24763</link>
		<dc:creator>alcaray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Jul 2013 17:14:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://habitablezone.com/?p=34359#comment-24763</guid>
		<description>Your argument is crystal clear but you did not show a basis for the need for deterence.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your argument is crystal clear but you did not show a basis for the need for deterence.</p>
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