I have known al for well over 10, years and I have never seen an occasion where he felt it was his role to “pour oil on troubled waters”.

Phillip Pullman’s “His Dark Materials” book series is hardly obscure and has been the subject of a thread here at least once when “The Golden Compass” film premiered in 2007. You sound exactly like the Pullman critics who called him an evil godless son of a bitch, when they recommended that no one view the Golden Compass film.

Second you act wounded that I called you a hater when that is not a fact. Perhaps it was an implication since you did refer to the “hatred” spewed from “that evil son of a bitch” Card.

Many of his detractors have a milder view of his opinions. It sounds like you hate Card, but only you can confirm that. It is at least a gross over-reaction to the film and Card for anyone claiming any degree of moderation. My Gay grandson has a milder opinion.

It sometimes appears that when any subject is broached some liberals can’t resist latching on the slightest hint of political incorrectness just to take advantage of an opportunity to appear as a golden haired mensch and defender of social morality.

This is not a Town Hall Robert, we are supposed to be among friends. It would not have been inappropriate to mention the Card controversy as a simple point of interest but you have gone way too far for light conversation.

If you wish to crucify Card start a thread on Flame and I will decide whether or not to participate

So Tom, am I correct in interpreting your response as an endorsement of this, for example? Or how about this, which ends:

How long before married people answer the dictators thus: Regardless of law, marriage has only one definition, and any government that attempts to change it is my mortal enemy. I will act to destroy that government and bring it down, so it can be replaced with a government that will respect and support marriage, and help me raise my children in a society where they will expect to marry in their turn.

Biological imperatives trump laws. American government cannot fight against marriage and hope to endure. If the Constitution is defined in such a way as to destroy the privileged position of marriage, it is that insane Constitution, not marriage, that will die.

Do you endorse all that, Tom? It sure sounds like it when you try to shut me up by calling me a bigot for pointing out bigotry. Address the issue, don’t attack me.

You seem to be calling me a “hater” for pointing out the hatred that’s spewed from Card in recent years. That really doesn’t impress me, Frank, sorry. Any more than Tom trying to say I’m bigoted for pointing out bigotry. Doesn’t work for me.

I’ve read lots of military fiction, and because that’s what it is, I simply expect that authors like Larry Niven and Ringo and David Drake and Tom Clancy ad nauseum will have rightwing political views, which is consistent with their writing. And I don’t recall that any of them ever expressed racist and homophobic views, only conservative political views.

I suspect you may be trying to pour oil on troubled waters, alcaray, but I can’t let the false equivalence pass. Are we talking about the same Orson Scott Card who wrote this blog post that managed to be both racist (dogwhistle language about Obama recruiting a private army of “urban males”) as well as politically bigoted, wallowing in several comparisons equating Obama with Hitler?

On the other hand, this is what the Dixie Chicks said in 2003 that almost destroyed their careers and got them hounded out of music for several years:

“Just so you know, we’re on the good side with y’all. We do not want this war, this violence, and we’re ashamed that the President of the United States is from Texas.”

Equivalent? I don’t think so. And I think I know you well enough by now to be confident that you don’t think so either.

I like military science fiction too, so I end up reading a lot of stuff written by right-wing fanatics (looking at you, Mr. Ringo). When the book is good it is good. When it is polemic and tedious, I try to get through it or I set it down.

Showing support = boycotting? I hated it when those assholes did it to the Dixie Chicks.

Most of the reviewers seem to think the film was sanitized in the way that “The Golden Spyglass” was to make it acceptable to those of any views.

Hardly an elephant.