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	<title>Comments on: Bridge of sighs</title>
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		<title>By: DanS</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31413</link>
		<dc:creator>DanS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Aug 2014 11:41:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31413</guid>
		<description>Sorry about your frustrations, b.  I was just referencing a rather ancient pamphlet my father had read me (or rather was reading out loud to anyone who might be listening), regarding his recently (c. 1965) purchased front porch flag.  I suppose it&#039;s now rather dated, like most of the stuff I think I &quot;know.&quot;

What remains true, however, is that:

We are not a nation of Flag-Wavers, but some of us are.

We are not a nation of Flag-Burners, but some of us are.

We are not a nation of NASCAR enthusiasts, but some of us are.

We&#039;re not a nation of Football fans (armchair or otherwise), but some of us are.

We are not a nation of Chess players, but some of us are.

We are not a nation of Gun-Toters, but some of us are.

...This could get awfully long.

What our forefathers designed for us to evolve into, b, was a Nation of Tolerance, not a Nation of Sides.  No matter what you run into out there, man, it&#039;s really just a bunch of opinions.  Don&#039;t let it boil your egg.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry about your frustrations, b.  I was just referencing a rather ancient pamphlet my father had read me (or rather was reading out loud to anyone who might be listening), regarding his recently (c. 1965) purchased front porch flag.  I suppose it&#8217;s now rather dated, like most of the stuff I think I &#8220;know.&#8221;</p>
<p>What remains true, however, is that:</p>
<p>We are not a nation of Flag-Wavers, but some of us are.</p>
<p>We are not a nation of Flag-Burners, but some of us are.</p>
<p>We are not a nation of NASCAR enthusiasts, but some of us are.</p>
<p>We&#8217;re not a nation of Football fans (armchair or otherwise), but some of us are.</p>
<p>We are not a nation of Chess players, but some of us are.</p>
<p>We are not a nation of Gun-Toters, but some of us are.</p>
<p>&#8230;This could get awfully long.</p>
<p>What our forefathers designed for us to evolve into, b, was a Nation of Tolerance, not a Nation of Sides.  No matter what you run into out there, man, it&#8217;s really just a bunch of opinions.  Don&#8217;t let it boil your egg.</p>
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		<title>By: bowser</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31407</link>
		<dc:creator>bowser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Aug 2014 14:10:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31407</guid>
		<description>I can&#039;t find anything which distinguishes between Federal property and other.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t find anything which distinguishes between Federal property and other.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31398</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Aug 2014 16:26:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31398</guid>
		<description>As far as I know, there is no legal or constitutional provisions for flag etiquette.  The colors are symbolic of the nation, and respect for the flag is only good manners and common courtesy, but it demands no detailed ritual or ceremony.  After all, even an atheist knows to remove his hat when entering a church (or put one on in Synagogue or Mosque).  It is just a sign of respect. God does not really give a shit.

In the military, there is a certain amount of flag ritual and ceremony because that is what passes for sentiment in that environment.  In many nation-states and military services (including our own Confederacy) there was a separate battle flag and civil colors.  Royal Navy ships fly a Naval Ensign, not the Union Jack. In the US Navy, the Jack (just the blue field and stars, no stripes) flies from the forepeak jackstaff in port.  The moment the ship casts off, the Jack is struck and Old Glory is hoisted to the top of the mast, where it flies, day and night, until the ship ties up again.

This reverence for the flag can be carried to ridiculous extremes.  I used to room with a military re-enactor who often wore a flight surgeon&#039;s uniform like the one her father wore in the Army Air Corps.  She scrupulously followed the decorations on her uniform, but was very upset because the American flag shoulder patch had the flag facing &quot;the wrong way.&quot; She was conflicted because wearing the uniform authentically required displaying the flag &quot;incorrectly&quot;.  When I pointed out that she was neither a man, a doctor, or in the military, and that the rules for flag display did not exist in the 1940s, she acted as if I were spitting on a crucifix.  

Although it is fitting that a certain amount of solemnity and dignity should be offered up to the national symbol, it seems to me that complex and detailed handling and display instructions for civilians borders on the creepy.  It is flag fetishism, and too often insisted on by pseudo-patriots and nationalistic bullies to intimidate those who dare to disagree with them. To hell with them.
They&#039;re not the boss of me.

See my post &quot;The first refuge, too.&quot;, below.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As far as I know, there is no legal or constitutional provisions for flag etiquette.  The colors are symbolic of the nation, and respect for the flag is only good manners and common courtesy, but it demands no detailed ritual or ceremony.  After all, even an atheist knows to remove his hat when entering a church (or put one on in Synagogue or Mosque).  It is just a sign of respect. God does not really give a shit.</p>
<p>In the military, there is a certain amount of flag ritual and ceremony because that is what passes for sentiment in that environment.  In many nation-states and military services (including our own Confederacy) there was a separate battle flag and civil colors.  Royal Navy ships fly a Naval Ensign, not the Union Jack. In the US Navy, the Jack (just the blue field and stars, no stripes) flies from the forepeak jackstaff in port.  The moment the ship casts off, the Jack is struck and Old Glory is hoisted to the top of the mast, where it flies, day and night, until the ship ties up again.</p>
<p>This reverence for the flag can be carried to ridiculous extremes.  I used to room with a military re-enactor who often wore a flight surgeon&#8217;s uniform like the one her father wore in the Army Air Corps.  She scrupulously followed the decorations on her uniform, but was very upset because the American flag shoulder patch had the flag facing &#8220;the wrong way.&#8221; She was conflicted because wearing the uniform authentically required displaying the flag &#8220;incorrectly&#8221;.  When I pointed out that she was neither a man, a doctor, or in the military, and that the rules for flag display did not exist in the 1940s, she acted as if I were spitting on a crucifix.  </p>
<p>Although it is fitting that a certain amount of solemnity and dignity should be offered up to the national symbol, it seems to me that complex and detailed handling and display instructions for civilians borders on the creepy.  It is flag fetishism, and too often insisted on by pseudo-patriots and nationalistic bullies to intimidate those who dare to disagree with them. To hell with them.<br />
They&#8217;re not the boss of me.</p>
<p>See my post &#8220;The first refuge, too.&#8221;, below.</p>
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		<title>By: DanS</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31397</link>
		<dc:creator>DanS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Aug 2014 15:37:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31397</guid>
		<description>The bought-n-paid for American Flag remains personal property, to be used/displayed as one wishes.  The rules you infer should be observed when on Federal property, such as a national parkland, but remain difficult to enforce even there, as many are now so ignorant of these rules.  Used to be taught in school, the Boy Scouts/Girl Scouts of America, even in local children&#039;s recreation halls -- a facility I have not seen for decades.

Bringing up the issue of improper Flag display at a KOA for the edification of an offender, though, is a great way to make them feel, at the least, self-conscious.  Later on, they may even get a bit o&#039; readin&#039; in &#039;em.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The bought-n-paid for American Flag remains personal property, to be used/displayed as one wishes.  The rules you infer should be observed when on Federal property, such as a national parkland, but remain difficult to enforce even there, as many are now so ignorant of these rules.  Used to be taught in school, the Boy Scouts/Girl Scouts of America, even in local children&#8217;s recreation halls &#8212; a facility I have not seen for decades.</p>
<p>Bringing up the issue of improper Flag display at a KOA for the edification of an offender, though, is a great way to make them feel, at the least, self-conscious.  Later on, they may even get a bit o&#8217; readin&#8217; in &#8216;em.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31395</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Aug 2014 12:20:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31395</guid>
		<description>He who loudly and continuously boasts of his patriotism, or questions the patriotism of others, is really implying
all who disagree or oppose him must be traitors.  It is one of the favorite tactics of fascists: to conflate their own parochial and self-serving interests with those of the nation.

I love my wife, too, but I wonder about the man who feels compelled to put it on a bumper sticker.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>He who loudly and continuously boasts of his patriotism, or questions the patriotism of others, is really implying<br />
all who disagree or oppose him must be traitors.  It is one of the favorite tactics of fascists: to conflate their own parochial and self-serving interests with those of the nation.</p>
<p>I love my wife, too, but I wonder about the man who feels compelled to put it on a bumper sticker.</p>
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		<title>By: bowser</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31393</link>
		<dc:creator>bowser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Aug 2014 03:47:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31393</guid>
		<description>On my travels, on those rare occasions I stay in RV parks, almost every single $500,000 RV puts up an American flag on a pole and leaves it there during the duration of their stay.  These are people who light a barbecue, pull out beer or bourbon, and bitch about people who don&#039;t work for a living.)

They do not take it down at night, illuminate it at night, or bring it in during rainy weather.  All violations of the rules for displaying an American flag.

Should they be prosecuted?  (Of course, and then shot.)

As Mark Twain said, &quot;Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel.&quot;  Absolutely true.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On my travels, on those rare occasions I stay in RV parks, almost every single $500,000 RV puts up an American flag on a pole and leaves it there during the duration of their stay.  These are people who light a barbecue, pull out beer or bourbon, and bitch about people who don&#8217;t work for a living.)</p>
<p>They do not take it down at night, illuminate it at night, or bring it in during rainy weather.  All violations of the rules for displaying an American flag.</p>
<p>Should they be prosecuted?  (Of course, and then shot.)</p>
<p>As Mark Twain said, &#8220;Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel.&#8221;  Absolutely true.</p>
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		<title>By: DanS</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31381</link>
		<dc:creator>DanS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2014 14:44:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31381</guid>
		<description>Get a fleet of VW Bugs for parts.  (n/t)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Get a fleet of VW Bugs for parts.  (n/t)</p>
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		<title>By: DanS</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31380</link>
		<dc:creator>DanS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2014 14:43:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31380</guid>
		<description>...provided you paid for the American flag you&#039;re burning at a duly licensed demonstration.  Symbolism, using private property, is more than acceptable, it&#039;s legal.

The event in question, however, involves city property, and is therefore a city crime, one which should be able to call in all levels of investigation, from on-site cameras to DNA fingerprinting.

And as for the vulnerability of that bridge, the security is likely not as it was, just a few days ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;provided you paid for the American flag you&#8217;re burning at a duly licensed demonstration.  Symbolism, using private property, is more than acceptable, it&#8217;s legal.</p>
<p>The event in question, however, involves city property, and is therefore a city crime, one which should be able to call in all levels of investigation, from on-site cameras to DNA fingerprinting.</p>
<p>And as for the vulnerability of that bridge, the security is likely not as it was, just a few days ago.</p>
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		<title>By: bowser</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31375</link>
		<dc:creator>bowser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jul 2014 17:20:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31375</guid>
		<description>Yabut the operating manuals are cheap.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yabut the operating manuals are cheap.</p>
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		<title>By: mcfly</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2014/07/26/bridge-of-sighs/#comment-31374</link>
		<dc:creator>mcfly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jul 2014 13:11:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=46429#comment-31374</guid>
		<description>There can&#039;t possibly be that many U-boats left! Why would they want such an old sub anyway? It&#039;d be murder trying to find spare parts...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There can&#8217;t possibly be that many U-boats left! Why would they want such an old sub anyway? It&#8217;d be murder trying to find spare parts&#8230;</p>
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