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	<title>Comments on: The diminishing cube</title>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2015/10/17/the-diminishing-cube/#comment-33178</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2015 22:21:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=51236#comment-33178</guid>
		<description>Neven&#039;s Arctic Sea Ice Blog, in my opinion, the best source on the net for sea ice interpretation and news, has just recently published a feature you might be interested in: &quot;Arctic Sea Ice in Pre-election Perception&quot;, which examines the public response to this issue.

http://neven1.typepad.com/

Denying science is definitely lucrative business. I learned it the hard way, I used to work for the Atomic Energy Commission/Nuclear Power Industry&#039;s propaganda branch.  I must admit, compared to some of the examples you bring up, these guys were relatively ethical, positively benign in comparison.  Still, I had a pitch on high-level nuclear power plant waste that would make you want to go out and buy stock in it, in fact, invest your life savings in it.  It was all true, too.  No technical expert could point to anything incorrect in it (we were cautioned not to lie, make things up, or otherwise give our opponents any ammunition that could be used against us).  But it was a masterpiece of cherry-picked data, slanted interpretations, convenient half-truths and left out, or stopped short, or skipped over all the negative interpretations.  It was a masterpiece of deceit, without once telling an outright untruth.  I know how these creeps work, I almost became one.

This sort of thing didn&#039;t start with cigarettes and lung cancer.  Are you old enough to recall the smear job the pesticide industry did on Rachel Carson after she published &quot;Silent Spring&quot;? And I recognize the same hand at work today in the firearms debate.

There is a certain mentality in our private sector that feels that anyone who has the audacity to question their motives or practices (or profits)is an enemy of freedom and civilization and that anything done to discredit or even destroy their critics is not only justifiable, but a patriotic act.

And as you point out, this is just not the expected response of an industry to protect its profits.  An institutional infrastructure of lawyers, lobbyists public relations types and other shills has arisen with the expertise and skills to employ these tactics on behalf of any industry engaged in selling death and poison.  

And now, they have allied themselves with a political ideology.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neven&#8217;s Arctic Sea Ice Blog, in my opinion, the best source on the net for sea ice interpretation and news, has just recently published a feature you might be interested in: &#8220;Arctic Sea Ice in Pre-election Perception&#8221;, which examines the public response to this issue.</p>
<p><a href="http://neven1.typepad.com/" rel="nofollow">http://neven1.typepad.com/</a></p>
<p>Denying science is definitely lucrative business. I learned it the hard way, I used to work for the Atomic Energy Commission/Nuclear Power Industry&#8217;s propaganda branch.  I must admit, compared to some of the examples you bring up, these guys were relatively ethical, positively benign in comparison.  Still, I had a pitch on high-level nuclear power plant waste that would make you want to go out and buy stock in it, in fact, invest your life savings in it.  It was all true, too.  No technical expert could point to anything incorrect in it (we were cautioned not to lie, make things up, or otherwise give our opponents any ammunition that could be used against us).  But it was a masterpiece of cherry-picked data, slanted interpretations, convenient half-truths and left out, or stopped short, or skipped over all the negative interpretations.  It was a masterpiece of deceit, without once telling an outright untruth.  I know how these creeps work, I almost became one.</p>
<p>This sort of thing didn&#8217;t start with cigarettes and lung cancer.  Are you old enough to recall the smear job the pesticide industry did on Rachel Carson after she published &#8220;Silent Spring&#8221;? And I recognize the same hand at work today in the firearms debate.</p>
<p>There is a certain mentality in our private sector that feels that anyone who has the audacity to question their motives or practices (or profits)is an enemy of freedom and civilization and that anything done to discredit or even destroy their critics is not only justifiable, but a patriotic act.</p>
<p>And as you point out, this is just not the expected response of an industry to protect its profits.  An institutional infrastructure of lawyers, lobbyists public relations types and other shills has arisen with the expertise and skills to employ these tactics on behalf of any industry engaged in selling death and poison.  </p>
<p>And now, they have allied themselves with a political ideology.</p>
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		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2015/10/17/the-diminishing-cube/#comment-33176</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2015 20:12:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=51236#comment-33176</guid>
		<description>Here is something I wrote on the misinformation industry a while back...

&lt;a href=&quot;http://arrell.newsvine.com/_news/2013/09/24/20680347-global-warming-denial-and-astroturfing&quot; title=&quot;Astroturfing the Science&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://arrell.newsvine.com/_news/2013/09/24/20680347-global-warming-denial-and-astroturfing&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here is something I wrote on the misinformation industry a while back&#8230;</p>
<p><a href="http://arrell.newsvine.com/_news/2013/09/24/20680347-global-warming-denial-and-astroturfing" title="Astroturfing the Science" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://arrell.newsvine.com/_news/2013/09/24/20680347-global-warming-denial-and-astroturfing</a></p>
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		<title>By: mcfly</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2015/10/17/the-diminishing-cube/#comment-33173</link>
		<dc:creator>mcfly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2015 17:44:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=51236#comment-33173</guid>
		<description>Remember the other group, as yet very small (I hope...)

I think it was Dan that pointed them out, those who embrace and celebrate anthropomorphic climate change as proof of humanity&#039;s immense power. I couldn&#039;t find the article and can&#039;t remember what they called themselves  (though I can think of a few names...).

I guess there&#039;s always a lunatic fringe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Remember the other group, as yet very small (I hope&#8230;)</p>
<p>I think it was Dan that pointed them out, those who embrace and celebrate anthropomorphic climate change as proof of humanity&#8217;s immense power. I couldn&#8217;t find the article and can&#8217;t remember what they called themselves  (though I can think of a few names&#8230;).</p>
<p>I guess there&#8217;s always a lunatic fringe.</p>
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		<title>By: bowser</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2015/10/17/the-diminishing-cube/#comment-33165</link>
		<dc:creator>bowser</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2015 04:59:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=51236#comment-33165</guid>
		<description>As I posted before.  I had the chance to spend a day with a former executive of NOAA.  I asked him about the public reaction to climate change.  He replied that there were three of them.\\

First, there were those who accepted the scientific evaluations and climate change is real and man-made.

Next, there are those who reject it using religion as the basis.  They also believe in Creationism, the virgin birth and all else associated with the Bible.

And third, there are those who believe the energy companies and don&#039;t believe in it because they don&#039;t want to.  This is the same model used for years by the cigarette companies.

And he was emphatic.  Climate change at a precipitous speed is man-made and very real.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As I posted before.  I had the chance to spend a day with a former executive of NOAA.  I asked him about the public reaction to climate change.  He replied that there were three of them.\\</p>
<p>First, there were those who accepted the scientific evaluations and climate change is real and man-made.</p>
<p>Next, there are those who reject it using religion as the basis.  They also believe in Creationism, the virgin birth and all else associated with the Bible.</p>
<p>And third, there are those who believe the energy companies and don&#8217;t believe in it because they don&#8217;t want to.  This is the same model used for years by the cigarette companies.</p>
<p>And he was emphatic.  Climate change at a precipitous speed is man-made and very real.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2015/10/17/the-diminishing-cube/#comment-33163</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2015 03:46:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=51236#comment-33163</guid>
		<description>Its not motivated by scientific or even ideological conviction.  Its that the True Believers realize that if any part of their dogma is called into question, then their entire philosophical edifice is threatened and starts to unravel, even those issues that may have nothing to do with climate.

This may not be evident in people like the oil companies, or pure capital, who see it as merely a threat to their financial interests.  They are perfectly capable of publicly opposing the concept while feverishly preparing for its consequences privately.  But for those who have incorporated it into their world view and made it a part of their belief system, it must be opposed on quasi-religious grounds.  This is why the objections to AGW are not necessarily scientific, but often rely on elaborate political conspiracy theories and shadowy cabals of sinister villains.  Like Darwinian evolution, Climate Change isn&#039;t just wrong, and its proponents are not merely mistaken.  It has to be a plot by the Lord of the Flies himself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its not motivated by scientific or even ideological conviction.  Its that the True Believers realize that if any part of their dogma is called into question, then their entire philosophical edifice is threatened and starts to unravel, even those issues that may have nothing to do with climate.</p>
<p>This may not be evident in people like the oil companies, or pure capital, who see it as merely a threat to their financial interests.  They are perfectly capable of publicly opposing the concept while feverishly preparing for its consequences privately.  But for those who have incorporated it into their world view and made it a part of their belief system, it must be opposed on quasi-religious grounds.  This is why the objections to AGW are not necessarily scientific, but often rely on elaborate political conspiracy theories and shadowy cabals of sinister villains.  Like Darwinian evolution, Climate Change isn&#8217;t just wrong, and its proponents are not merely mistaken.  It has to be a plot by the Lord of the Flies himself.</p>
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		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2015/10/17/the-diminishing-cube/#comment-33142</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Oct 2015 23:34:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=51236#comment-33142</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/08/exxon-climate-change-1981-climate-denier-funding&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/08/exxon-climate-change-1981-climate-denier-funding&lt;/a&gt;

Even Exxon realized AGW was real in the 80&#039;s and factored it into their business plan.

While there are a few idiots still denying the science, and many well funded groups working to lie about the science, it should be painfully clear to all but the most blind that anthropogenic global warming is an established fact. 

Those that slandered the scientists and successfully worked to prevent any action will be damned by future generations.

Its no longer a question of &quot;How much will it cost us to avoid global warming&quot;... the question is now &quot;How many hundreds of millions will die from the direct and indirect impacts of the global warming we have allowed, and will civilization as we know it be able to carry on under the burden imposed on it&quot;

I have thought about proposing a kickstarter to fund a small satellite to be put in Geosynchronous orbit, carrying the names and words of those that deny the facts... so future generations will know who to curse for the mess they have inherited.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/08/exxon-climate-change-1981-climate-denier-funding" rel="nofollow">http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/08/exxon-climate-change-1981-climate-denier-funding</a></p>
<p>Even Exxon realized AGW was real in the 80&#8242;s and factored it into their business plan.</p>
<p>While there are a few idiots still denying the science, and many well funded groups working to lie about the science, it should be painfully clear to all but the most blind that anthropogenic global warming is an established fact. </p>
<p>Those that slandered the scientists and successfully worked to prevent any action will be damned by future generations.</p>
<p>Its no longer a question of &#8220;How much will it cost us to avoid global warming&#8221;&#8230; the question is now &#8220;How many hundreds of millions will die from the direct and indirect impacts of the global warming we have allowed, and will civilization as we know it be able to carry on under the burden imposed on it&#8221;</p>
<p>I have thought about proposing a kickstarter to fund a small satellite to be put in Geosynchronous orbit, carrying the names and words of those that deny the facts&#8230; so future generations will know who to curse for the mess they have inherited.</p>
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