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	<title>Comments on: Repealing Obamacare will kill more than 43,000 people a year</title>
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	<link>https://habitablezone.com/2017/06/26/repealing-obamacare-will-kill-more-than-43000-people-a-year/</link>
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		<title>By: podrock</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2017/06/26/repealing-obamacare-will-kill-more-than-43000-people-a-year/#comment-39536</link>
		<dc:creator>podrock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jun 2017 00:53:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=65086#comment-39536</guid>
		<description>or &quot;Don&#039;tCare&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>or &#8220;Don&#8217;tCare&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: podrock</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2017/06/26/repealing-obamacare-will-kill-more-than-43000-people-a-year/#comment-39535</link>
		<dc:creator>podrock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jun 2017 00:52:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=65086#comment-39535</guid>
		<description>(as seen online.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(as seen online.)</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2017/06/26/repealing-obamacare-will-kill-more-than-43000-people-a-year/#comment-39533</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jun 2017 22:17:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=65086#comment-39533</guid>
		<description>Or as you nicely described it: &quot;murder of tens of thousands for the profit of a few&quot;.

And profit is the key, the secret sauce lacking from the original Soylent concept, which was just a product of unimaginative big-government crisis-management thinking that simply tread water recycling Takers and Moochers into more Takers and Moochers.

Pffft! There&#039;s &lt;i&gt;profit&lt;/i&gt; in crisis, and Jonathon Swift understood the power of Free Market Thinking&#174; to sweep away any problem while turning a tidy profit. The BCRAP helps the poor, sick, elderly, and other parasitic undesirables transition out of their wretched state directly into cold hard cash! And I mean really cold and really hard! But cash, nevertheless, right into the pockets of Job Creators, the people naturally equipped and naturally inclined to help the poor, sick, and elderly.

Isn&#039;t it a thing of utter beauty?

Or is &quot;depravity&quot; the word I&#039;m looking for?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or as you nicely described it: &#8220;murder of tens of thousands for the profit of a few&#8221;.</p>
<p>And profit is the key, the secret sauce lacking from the original Soylent concept, which was just a product of unimaginative big-government crisis-management thinking that simply tread water recycling Takers and Moochers into more Takers and Moochers.</p>
<p>Pffft! There&#8217;s <i>profit</i> in crisis, and Jonathon Swift understood the power of Free Market Thinking&reg; to sweep away any problem while turning a tidy profit. The BCRAP helps the poor, sick, elderly, and other parasitic undesirables transition out of their wretched state directly into cold hard cash! And I mean really cold and really hard! But cash, nevertheless, right into the pockets of Job Creators, the people naturally equipped and naturally inclined to help the poor, sick, and elderly.</p>
<p>Isn&#8217;t it a thing of utter beauty?</p>
<p>Or is &#8220;depravity&#8221; the word I&#8217;m looking for?</p>
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		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2017/06/26/repealing-obamacare-will-kill-more-than-43000-people-a-year/#comment-39532</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jun 2017 21:28:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=65086#comment-39532</guid>
		<description>It has 17% support- this isn&#039;t a health care bill- it is pillaging by the top 1%, it is murder of tens of thousands for the profit of a few.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It has 17% support- this isn&#8217;t a health care bill- it is pillaging by the top 1%, it is murder of tens of thousands for the profit of a few.</p>
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		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2017/06/26/repealing-obamacare-will-kill-more-than-43000-people-a-year/#comment-39531</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jun 2017 21:10:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=65086#comment-39531</guid>
		<description>Of course he really just wants those &#039;Takers&#039; to just do the decent thing and die, but he cant really say that... The only way to have a system where we  ARE NOT paying for the uninsured is if we just kill them... 
That is what the healthcare bill under debate would start doing...

Actual facts on the costs of the uninsured can be found:
&lt;a href=&quot;https://insight.kellogg.northwestern.edu/article/who-bears-the-cost-of-the-uninsured-nonprofit-hospitals&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https://insight.kellogg.northwestern.edu/article/who-bears-the-cost-of-the-uninsured-nonprofit-hospitals&lt;/a&gt;

&lt;a href=&quot;https://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/washington/2011-05-09-uninsured-unpaid-hospital-bills_n.htm&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Up to $49 billion unpaid by uninsured for hospitalizations&lt;/a&gt;



&lt;blockquote&gt;WASHINGTON — Uninsured Americans — including those with incomes well above the poverty line — leave hospitals with unpaid tabs of up to $49 billion a year, according to a USA TODAY analysis of government statistics.

On average, uninsured families can pay only about 12% of their hospital bills in full. Families with incomes above 400% of the poverty level, or about $88,000 a year for a family of four, pay about 37% of their hospital bills in full, according to the Department of Health and Human Services study.

&quot;This report shows that even higher-income, uninsured families are struggling to meet the high costs of health care,&quot; Sherry Glied, assistant secretary for planning and evaluation at Health and Human Services, said in a statement. &quot;No family should bear the burden of being one illness or accident away from bankruptcy.&quot;

Researchers also found that most uninsured people have &quot;virtually no&quot; savings and that about a third have no financial assets.

Health and Human Services released the report as the White House defends the federal health care law passed last year, which was intended to address growing health care costs as well as ensure all Americans can afford health insurance. Republicans have pledged to repeal the federal health care law, saying that government should not take away individual choices and that the law will cost too much. Glied said the study shows the importance of health insurance for all Americans.

Paul Winfree, a senior policy analyst at the conservative Heritage Foundation think tank, disagreed, saying the study showed how Americans can exploit the system. &quot;With ($88,000), families should be able to buy insurance,&quot; he said. &quot;They choose not to.&quot;

He said that while he realizes hospitalizations tend to be expensive, Americans need to look at their spending and saving habits.

Jack Hadley, senior health services researcher at George Mason University in Fairfax, Va., pointed out that uninsured people are charged as much as two-thirds more than what insured people are charged because insurers are able to negotiate prices.

His research has found that privately insured individuals don&#039;t end up paying higher premiums to make up for the uninsured because hospitals that serve lower-income families don&#039;t have a lot of patients with insurance. He said the government pays about 75% of those unpaid hospital bills either by direct payment or through a disproportionate payment of Medicaid.

&quot;It affects taxes, not premiums,&quot; he said. &quot;The privately insured are still paying for it.&quot;

Jim Tallon, president of the non-profit United Hospital Fund, said the federal health care law&#039;s mandate that most Americans be insured is a step in the right direction. Hospital officials are &quot;nervous&quot; about proposed medical cuts in the House budget, he said.

&quot;Most of the major hospital associations were supportive of the Affordable Care Act for this reason,&quot; he said. &quot;They were willing to take some cost reductions in Medicare payments, and in return, the government would insure 32 million people.&quot;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;



Of course hospitals aren&#039;t just innocent victims:
&lt;a href=&quot;https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/why-some-hospitals-can-get-away-with-price-gouging-patients-study-finds/2015/06/08/b7f5118c-0aeb-11e5-9e39-0db921c47b93_story.html?utm_term=.69b3440c4847&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;50 hospitals charge uninsured more than 10 times cost of care, study finds&lt;/a&gt;
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/why-some-hospitals-can-get-away-with-price-gouging-patients-study-finds/2015/06/08/b7f5118c-0aeb-11e5-9e39-0db921c47b93_story.html?utm_term=.69b3440c4847

There are also the less direct costs created by countless families going bankrupt...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course he really just wants those &#8216;Takers&#8217; to just do the decent thing and die, but he cant really say that&#8230; The only way to have a system where we  ARE NOT paying for the uninsured is if we just kill them&#8230;<br />
That is what the healthcare bill under debate would start doing&#8230;</p>
<p>Actual facts on the costs of the uninsured can be found:<br />
<a href="https://insight.kellogg.northwestern.edu/article/who-bears-the-cost-of-the-uninsured-nonprofit-hospitals" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">https://insight.kellogg.northwestern.edu/article/who-bears-the-cost-of-the-uninsured-nonprofit-hospitals</a></p>
<p><a href="https://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/washington/2011-05-09-uninsured-unpaid-hospital-bills_n.htm" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Up to $49 billion unpaid by uninsured for hospitalizations</a></p>
<blockquote><p>WASHINGTON — Uninsured Americans — including those with incomes well above the poverty line — leave hospitals with unpaid tabs of up to $49 billion a year, according to a USA TODAY analysis of government statistics.</p>
<p>On average, uninsured families can pay only about 12% of their hospital bills in full. Families with incomes above 400% of the poverty level, or about $88,000 a year for a family of four, pay about 37% of their hospital bills in full, according to the Department of Health and Human Services study.</p>
<p>&#8220;This report shows that even higher-income, uninsured families are struggling to meet the high costs of health care,&#8221; Sherry Glied, assistant secretary for planning and evaluation at Health and Human Services, said in a statement. &#8220;No family should bear the burden of being one illness or accident away from bankruptcy.&#8221;</p>
<p>Researchers also found that most uninsured people have &#8220;virtually no&#8221; savings and that about a third have no financial assets.</p>
<p>Health and Human Services released the report as the White House defends the federal health care law passed last year, which was intended to address growing health care costs as well as ensure all Americans can afford health insurance. Republicans have pledged to repeal the federal health care law, saying that government should not take away individual choices and that the law will cost too much. Glied said the study shows the importance of health insurance for all Americans.</p>
<p>Paul Winfree, a senior policy analyst at the conservative Heritage Foundation think tank, disagreed, saying the study showed how Americans can exploit the system. &#8220;With ($88,000), families should be able to buy insurance,&#8221; he said. &#8220;They choose not to.&#8221;</p>
<p>He said that while he realizes hospitalizations tend to be expensive, Americans need to look at their spending and saving habits.</p>
<p>Jack Hadley, senior health services researcher at George Mason University in Fairfax, Va., pointed out that uninsured people are charged as much as two-thirds more than what insured people are charged because insurers are able to negotiate prices.</p>
<p>His research has found that privately insured individuals don&#8217;t end up paying higher premiums to make up for the uninsured because hospitals that serve lower-income families don&#8217;t have a lot of patients with insurance. He said the government pays about 75% of those unpaid hospital bills either by direct payment or through a disproportionate payment of Medicaid.</p>
<p>&#8220;It affects taxes, not premiums,&#8221; he said. &#8220;The privately insured are still paying for it.&#8221;</p>
<p>Jim Tallon, president of the non-profit United Hospital Fund, said the federal health care law&#8217;s mandate that most Americans be insured is a step in the right direction. Hospital officials are &#8220;nervous&#8221; about proposed medical cuts in the House budget, he said.</p>
<p>&#8220;Most of the major hospital associations were supportive of the Affordable Care Act for this reason,&#8221; he said. &#8220;They were willing to take some cost reductions in Medicare payments, and in return, the government would insure 32 million people.&#8221;
</p></blockquote>
<p>Of course hospitals aren&#8217;t just innocent victims:<br />
<a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/why-some-hospitals-can-get-away-with-price-gouging-patients-study-finds/2015/06/08/b7f5118c-0aeb-11e5-9e39-0db921c47b93_story.html?utm_term=.69b3440c4847" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">50 hospitals charge uninsured more than 10 times cost of care, study finds</a><br />
<a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/why-some-hospitals-can-get-away-with-price-gouging-patients-study-finds/2015/06/08/b7f5118c-0aeb-11e5-9e39-0db921c47b93_story.html?utm_term=.69b3440c4847" rel="nofollow">https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/why-some-hospitals-can-get-away-with-price-gouging-patients-study-finds/2015/06/08/b7f5118c-0aeb-11e5-9e39-0db921c47b93_story.html?utm_term=.69b3440c4847</a></p>
<p>There are also the less direct costs created by countless families going bankrupt&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2017/06/26/repealing-obamacare-will-kill-more-than-43000-people-a-year/#comment-39530</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jun 2017 20:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=65086#comment-39530</guid>
		<description>...the Better Care Reconciliation Act will deprive one million fewer people of health insurance than the House bill.

The bad news? All of it, Katie. Specifically still horrible: 22 million people &lt;strike&gt;converted to Soylent&lt;/strike&gt;uninsured by 2026. (From a &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/imminent-cbo-report-could-prove-pivotal-for-senate-republicans-health-care-bill/2017/06/26/cb8d61e2-59f7-11e7-a9f6-7c3296387341_story.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;WashPost report&lt;/a&gt;).

&quot;So, dude, how&#039;s your Better Care Reconciliation Act Plan?&quot;

&quot;Oh man, it B-CRAP!&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;the Better Care Reconciliation Act will deprive one million fewer people of health insurance than the House bill.</p>
<p>The bad news? All of it, Katie. Specifically still horrible: 22 million people <strike>converted to Soylent</strike>uninsured by 2026. (From a <a href="https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/imminent-cbo-report-could-prove-pivotal-for-senate-republicans-health-care-bill/2017/06/26/cb8d61e2-59f7-11e7-a9f6-7c3296387341_story.html" rel="nofollow">WashPost report</a>).</p>
<p>&#8220;So, dude, how&#8217;s your Better Care Reconciliation Act Plan?&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Oh man, it B-CRAP!&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: hank</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2017/06/26/repealing-obamacare-will-kill-more-than-43000-people-a-year/#comment-39529</link>
		<dc:creator>hank</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jun 2017 20:22:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=65086#comment-39529</guid>
		<description>This has already been litigated in the Zone, years ago.

https://www.habitablezone.com/?prosc_taxopt=global%3A&amp;s=emergency+room

&lt;em&gt;Emergency rooms by TB October 14, 2013 8:14 pm &lt;/em&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This has already been litigated in the Zone, years ago.</p>
<p><a href="https://www.habitablezone.com/?prosc_taxopt=global%3A&#038;s=emergency+room" rel="nofollow">https://www.habitablezone.com/?prosc_taxopt=global%3A&#038;s=emergency+room</a></p>
<p><em>Emergency rooms by TB October 14, 2013 8:14 pm </em></p>
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		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2017/06/26/repealing-obamacare-will-kill-more-than-43000-people-a-year/#comment-39528</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jun 2017 18:53:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=65086#comment-39528</guid>
		<description>http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2009/09/new-study-finds-45000-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/



&lt;blockquote&gt;Nearly 45,000 annual deaths are associated with lack of health insurance, according to a new study published online today by the American Journal of Public Health. That figure is about two and a half times higher than an estimate from the Institute of Medicine (IOM) in 2002.

The study, conducted at Harvard Medical School and Cambridge Health Alliance, found that uninsured, working-age Americans have a 40 percent higher risk of death than their privately insured counterparts, up from a 25 percent excess death rate found in 1993.

“The uninsured have a higher risk of death when compared to the privately insured, even after taking into account socioeconomics, health behaviors, and baseline health,” said lead author Andrew Wilper, M.D., who currently teaches at the University of Washington School of Medicine. “We doctors have many new ways to prevent deaths from hypertension, diabetes, and heart disease — but only if patients can get into our offices and afford their medications.”&lt;/blockquote&gt;

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2009/09/new-study-finds-45000-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/" rel="nofollow">http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2009/09/new-study-finds-45000-deaths-annually-linked-to-lack-of-health-coverage/</a></p>
<blockquote><p>Nearly 45,000 annual deaths are associated with lack of health insurance, according to a new study published online today by the American Journal of Public Health. That figure is about two and a half times higher than an estimate from the Institute of Medicine (IOM) in 2002.</p>
<p>The study, conducted at Harvard Medical School and Cambridge Health Alliance, found that uninsured, working-age Americans have a 40 percent higher risk of death than their privately insured counterparts, up from a 25 percent excess death rate found in 1993.</p>
<p>“The uninsured have a higher risk of death when compared to the privately insured, even after taking into account socioeconomics, health behaviors, and baseline health,” said lead author Andrew Wilper, M.D., who currently teaches at the University of Washington School of Medicine. “We doctors have many new ways to prevent deaths from hypertension, diabetes, and heart disease — but only if patients can get into our offices and afford their medications.”</p></blockquote>
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