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	<title>Comments on: The Quantum Soul is Eternal?</title>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43618</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Sep 2019 20:46:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43618</guid>
		<description>I read somewhere some recent research on temperate forests has been published that they behave in much the same way, that individual trees &quot;communicate&quot; with one another to warn others of attacks by insects or other pests, that this communication is chemical, and often carried from tree to tree by interlocking nets of fungi that interconnect different trees (sometimes of DIFFERENT SPECIES!) so they can protect themselves (using chemical defenses) against the invaders.  We already know that different trees compete for nutrients, sunlight etc, but we know now that sometimes they cooperate as well!  This is not necessarily &quot;conscious&quot; behavior as we identify it, but who knows what other forms of &quot;behavior&quot; some ecosystems have evolved?  Anything is possible.

Just think, just a few thousand years ago, a blink in geologic time, vast parts of Europe and North America were under a mile of solid ice.  Today, the glacier is gone and these barren, scraped lands are covered with a dense network of biological communities, habitats and ecosystems that have evolved into every niche in those environments.  Biogeographical change occurs much faster than biological evolution, and certainly faster than geological activity.
It would not be unreasonable to suspect some form of consciousness was assisting here; not the consciousness of a god or spirit, but something inherent in and emerging from organic life itself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I read somewhere some recent research on temperate forests has been published that they behave in much the same way, that individual trees &#8220;communicate&#8221; with one another to warn others of attacks by insects or other pests, that this communication is chemical, and often carried from tree to tree by interlocking nets of fungi that interconnect different trees (sometimes of DIFFERENT SPECIES!) so they can protect themselves (using chemical defenses) against the invaders.  We already know that different trees compete for nutrients, sunlight etc, but we know now that sometimes they cooperate as well!  This is not necessarily &#8220;conscious&#8221; behavior as we identify it, but who knows what other forms of &#8220;behavior&#8221; some ecosystems have evolved?  Anything is possible.</p>
<p>Just think, just a few thousand years ago, a blink in geologic time, vast parts of Europe and North America were under a mile of solid ice.  Today, the glacier is gone and these barren, scraped lands are covered with a dense network of biological communities, habitats and ecosystems that have evolved into every niche in those environments.  Biogeographical change occurs much faster than biological evolution, and certainly faster than geological activity.<br />
It would not be unreasonable to suspect some form of consciousness was assisting here; not the consciousness of a god or spirit, but something inherent in and emerging from organic life itself.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43617</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Sep 2019 20:28:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43617</guid>
		<description>No, by &quot;coral reef&quot; I mean the whole ecosystem, not just the polyps and their skeletons.

There are many species of coral in one reef, and the symbiotic algae that photosynthesize nutrients in their tissues.  Then there are all the fish, worms, molluscs, microbes, crustaceans and thousands of other creatures and plants that are living in the reef and contribute to its total metabolism, both as predator, prey or commensal and symbiotic relationships.  It is a community of many organisms, each being a cell in the larger body, and each group of similar &quot;cells&quot; acting as a different tissue in a huge collective.  At higher levels, the individual tissues work together as organs and organ systems. These all interact together in a variety of ways...the clown fish keeps the anemone clean and free of parasites and it receives protection and shelter from its host.  Neither could flourish without the other.

The reef consists of many species which depend on each other and do not exist in isolation, just as our blood, muscle, nerve, connective, bone and nerve cells and tissues interact to form an independent life form with a sense of its own existence and consciousness, but which, until recently, was completely unaware of the individual parts that made up the whole. We are all a multitude.

The reef, like any ecosystem, is an interactive system bound together through an infinite collection of relationships.  You can say the same for any ecosystem, but the coral reef and the tropical rain forest are the most complex ones on earth.  They may even be complex enough to evolve consciousness.

But if they have indeed evolved a consciousness, it is one that operates at time scales far slower than ours, and the devastation we inflict on those systems through our activities (like fishing with dynamite or logging, mining and slash-and-burn agriculture) is probably &quot;perceived&quot; the way we perceive the chemical imbalances we experience as infections or cancers.

We are a disease on this planet and if we don&#039;t stop soon, we will either kill it or we will change it to some form that will no longer support us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, by &#8220;coral reef&#8221; I mean the whole ecosystem, not just the polyps and their skeletons.</p>
<p>There are many species of coral in one reef, and the symbiotic algae that photosynthesize nutrients in their tissues.  Then there are all the fish, worms, molluscs, microbes, crustaceans and thousands of other creatures and plants that are living in the reef and contribute to its total metabolism, both as predator, prey or commensal and symbiotic relationships.  It is a community of many organisms, each being a cell in the larger body, and each group of similar &#8220;cells&#8221; acting as a different tissue in a huge collective.  At higher levels, the individual tissues work together as organs and organ systems. These all interact together in a variety of ways&#8230;the clown fish keeps the anemone clean and free of parasites and it receives protection and shelter from its host.  Neither could flourish without the other.</p>
<p>The reef consists of many species which depend on each other and do not exist in isolation, just as our blood, muscle, nerve, connective, bone and nerve cells and tissues interact to form an independent life form with a sense of its own existence and consciousness, but which, until recently, was completely unaware of the individual parts that made up the whole. We are all a multitude.</p>
<p>The reef, like any ecosystem, is an interactive system bound together through an infinite collection of relationships.  You can say the same for any ecosystem, but the coral reef and the tropical rain forest are the most complex ones on earth.  They may even be complex enough to evolve consciousness.</p>
<p>But if they have indeed evolved a consciousness, it is one that operates at time scales far slower than ours, and the devastation we inflict on those systems through our activities (like fishing with dynamite or logging, mining and slash-and-burn agriculture) is probably &#8220;perceived&#8221; the way we perceive the chemical imbalances we experience as infections or cancers.</p>
<p>We are a disease on this planet and if we don&#8217;t stop soon, we will either kill it or we will change it to some form that will no longer support us.</p>
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		<title>By: DanS</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43616</link>
		<dc:creator>DanS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Sep 2019 18:28:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43616</guid>
		<description>Plants have been show to respond to direct stimuli, as have coral, but not necessarily to think, although it remains a possibility.

Coral, though, is much less populated and living in a 2D world. You can walk into a forest, but once you reach the coral, you&#039;re not going any deeper without a lot of help (picks, dynamite, a saw...). A healthy lump of coral is animal and may look like a brain, but I&#039;m pretty sure most of it (the interior) is lifeless calcium mineral deposit, like a clam shell. A healthy forest, on the other hand, is entirely living, but still an inoffensive plant and harder to read.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Plants have been show to respond to direct stimuli, as have coral, but not necessarily to think, although it remains a possibility.</p>
<p>Coral, though, is much less populated and living in a 2D world. You can walk into a forest, but once you reach the coral, you&#8217;re not going any deeper without a lot of help (picks, dynamite, a saw&#8230;). A healthy lump of coral is animal and may look like a brain, but I&#8217;m pretty sure most of it (the interior) is lifeless calcium mineral deposit, like a clam shell. A healthy forest, on the other hand, is entirely living, but still an inoffensive plant and harder to read.</p>
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		<title>By: BuckGalaxy</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43612</link>
		<dc:creator>BuckGalaxy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Sep 2019 07:00:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43612</guid>
		<description>Are the stars alive?  Do they feed the lifeforms on their satellites with energy by intent?  Is dark matter related life?  Both are mysterious undefined properties of the universe. 

Silly concepts for sure, but the mystery of it all remains.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are the stars alive?  Do they feed the lifeforms on their satellites with energy by intent?  Is dark matter related life?  Both are mysterious undefined properties of the universe. </p>
<p>Silly concepts for sure, but the mystery of it all remains.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43611</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Sep 2019 03:02:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43611</guid>
		<description>Any sufficiently complex system could conceivably be self-aware, or be subdivided into a number of self-aware or conscious units. I&#039;ve often wondered if coral reef or tropical rainforest ecosystems may have some sort of &quot;intelligence&quot;, although it would be so alien (and operate at such extended time scales) that we might never be aware of it, or it, of us.

Novelist Stanislaw Lem has speculated on an entire planet being an intelligent entity in his novel Solaris.  Or perhaps Sagan got it right the first time, the universe allows (or causes!) intelligent life forms to evolve as its &quot;thinking&quot; organs.  This is the most likely scenario, since a self-aware consciousness may not appear spontaneously, but might much more easily evolve through Darwinian natural selection.

If it is indeed the case that there are super-intelligences like smart galaxies or smart stars or planets, our best strategy for detecting them would be to devise methods of communicating with them.  Unfortunately, I can&#039;t conceive of any such &quot;communication&quot; we could initiate that might not be  interpreted by the consciousness as an attack, a natural catastrophe, or even not be perceivable at all.

To sum up, there may be all sorts of consciousness(es) operating in the cosmos, but we may simply be incapable of recognizing it, or if we did, we might mistake it for a god.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Any sufficiently complex system could conceivably be self-aware, or be subdivided into a number of self-aware or conscious units. I&#8217;ve often wondered if coral reef or tropical rainforest ecosystems may have some sort of &#8220;intelligence&#8221;, although it would be so alien (and operate at such extended time scales) that we might never be aware of it, or it, of us.</p>
<p>Novelist Stanislaw Lem has speculated on an entire planet being an intelligent entity in his novel Solaris.  Or perhaps Sagan got it right the first time, the universe allows (or causes!) intelligent life forms to evolve as its &#8220;thinking&#8221; organs.  This is the most likely scenario, since a self-aware consciousness may not appear spontaneously, but might much more easily evolve through Darwinian natural selection.</p>
<p>If it is indeed the case that there are super-intelligences like smart galaxies or smart stars or planets, our best strategy for detecting them would be to devise methods of communicating with them.  Unfortunately, I can&#8217;t conceive of any such &#8220;communication&#8221; we could initiate that might not be  interpreted by the consciousness as an attack, a natural catastrophe, or even not be perceivable at all.</p>
<p>To sum up, there may be all sorts of consciousness(es) operating in the cosmos, but we may simply be incapable of recognizing it, or if we did, we might mistake it for a god.</p>
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		<title>By: DanS</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43608</link>
		<dc:creator>DanS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Sep 2019 16:51:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43608</guid>
		<description>Perhaps the universe is complex enough to actually be alive, as well as aware of many comparable things -- negative galaxies and super-massive black holes and such, great attractors -- to sort of pick at its own bits and nits, but certainly not of anything so inconsequential as a single sparrow falling from our skies. One day, when I&#039;m really bored (ain&#039;t happened yet), maybe I&#039;ll write a short story on that premise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps the universe is complex enough to actually be alive, as well as aware of many comparable things &#8212; negative galaxies and super-massive black holes and such, great attractors &#8212; to sort of pick at its own bits and nits, but certainly not of anything so inconsequential as a single sparrow falling from our skies. One day, when I&#8217;m really bored (ain&#8217;t happened yet), maybe I&#8217;ll write a short story on that premise.</p>
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		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43600</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Sep 2019 00:07:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43600</guid>
		<description>The tendency is to over-hype in order to get more clicks, or- even more often- the writer has no understanding of the subject and the article is completely incoherent.

It is so bad that once when I came across an exceptionally well written piece, I went out of the way to post a lengthy positive review in the comments section of the story and then contacted the publication directly to commend them for hiring such a competent writer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The tendency is to over-hype in order to get more clicks, or- even more often- the writer has no understanding of the subject and the article is completely incoherent.</p>
<p>It is so bad that once when I came across an exceptionally well written piece, I went out of the way to post a lengthy positive review in the comments section of the story and then contacted the publication directly to commend them for hiring such a competent writer.</p>
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		<title>By: DanS</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43599</link>
		<dc:creator>DanS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Sep 2019 23:44:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43599</guid>
		<description>&quot;Scientists Found That the Soul Doesn’t Die – It Goes Back to the Universe&quot; is one hell of a conclusion from 0 research, but that would be direct from the wack-job journalist.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Scientists Found That the Soul Doesn’t Die – It Goes Back to the Universe&#8221; is one hell of a conclusion from 0 research, but that would be direct from the wack-job journalist.</p>
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		<title>By: RL</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43597</link>
		<dc:creator>RL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Sep 2019 17:09:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43597</guid>
		<description>It is just navel-gazing, and sitting around saying &#039;dude, wouldn&#039;t it be cool if...&#039;

There is nothing wrong with doing that, of course- great discoveries start off that way- what is wrong is when you present that speculation as anything more than speculation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is just navel-gazing, and sitting around saying &#8216;dude, wouldn&#8217;t it be cool if&#8230;&#8217;</p>
<p>There is nothing wrong with doing that, of course- great discoveries start off that way- what is wrong is when you present that speculation as anything more than speculation.</p>
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		<title>By: DanS</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2019/08/30/the-quantum-soul-is-eternal/#comment-43596</link>
		<dc:creator>DanS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Sep 2019 17:02:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.habitablezone.com/?p=78104#comment-43596</guid>
		<description>I wonder how they did the research . . .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder how they did the research . . .</p>
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