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	<title>Comments on: Not woke enough for you?</title>
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		<title>By: podrock</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52121</link>
		<dc:creator>podrock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Aug 2023 22:10:22 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>sub-human since the Romans. Or should I say un-civilized? All they ever wanted was to be left the hell alone. 
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sub-human since the Romans. Or should I say un-civilized? All they ever wanted was to be left the hell alone.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52102</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Jul 2023 20:56:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://habitablezone.com/?p=100269#comment-52102</guid>
		<description>New College was just the start.

He is now systematically embarked on a program of replacing the governing bodies of all state universities with pro-business, Fundamentalist Christian, conservative and corporate types, culture warriors, and getting rid of all the professional educators and academic weenies.  The purpose of a university degree, apparently, is no longer woke, but work.

We&#039;re going back to the days of the Johns Committee.  (Look it up).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>New College was just the start.</p>
<p>He is now systematically embarked on a program of replacing the governing bodies of all state universities with pro-business, Fundamentalist Christian, conservative and corporate types, culture warriors, and getting rid of all the professional educators and academic weenies.  The purpose of a university degree, apparently, is no longer woke, but work.</p>
<p>We&#8217;re going back to the days of the Johns Committee.  (Look it up).</p>
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		<title>By: RobVG</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52101</link>
		<dc:creator>RobVG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Jul 2023 20:55:11 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I&#039;d like to read exactly what&#039;s being taught. n/t</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d like to read exactly what&#8217;s being taught. n/t</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52100</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Jul 2023 20:53:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://habitablezone.com/?p=100269#comment-52100</guid>
		<description>&quot;No Irish need apply&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;No Irish need apply&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: BuckGalaxy</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52099</link>
		<dc:creator>BuckGalaxy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Jul 2023 20:11:07 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I mean seriously, could anyone think of another way they could have gotten job skill training?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I mean seriously, could anyone think of another way they could have gotten job skill training?</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52098</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Jul 2023 15:00:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://habitablezone.com/?p=100269#comment-52098</guid>
		<description>https://news.yahoo.com/florida-schools-teach-slavery-brought-123130834.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="https://news.yahoo.com/florida-schools-teach-slavery-brought-123130834.html" rel="nofollow">https://news.yahoo.com/florida-schools-teach-slavery-brought-123130834.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52097</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Jul 2023 12:59:43 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The melting pot and ignorance of the world certainly have a lot to do with it,  but I also think it goes back a lot further than that.  I think it originates with the adoption of slavery by Monotheistic cultures.  The teachings of Christianity and Islam, with their emphasis on individual moral responsibility, made slavery incompatible with religious doctrine. In the pagan world, a slave was a prisoner, someone paying the price for committing a crime, or losing a war.  The slave was not inferior, or subhuman, he might have been royalty or an aristocrat prior to his enslavement. In fact, highly talented slaves were recognized as valuable assets, they could run your farm, or design your buildings, or manage your business. Many were enslaved for their math and literacy skills, becoming teachers and accountants. Many were employed as scribes, physicians, counselors and consultants.  They were slaves (and their children) because they had lost a war or committed a crime, not because they were subhuman creatures.  Slavery was something that happened to them, not something they were.  Their children automatically were slaves too, a concept natural to tribe and family oriented pagan cultures of the ancient world, but antithetical to the more individual oriented societies of the medieval world.

But Christianity and Islam taught all humans had rights and dignity in the eyes of god, and it was wrong to treat them as property.  In order to employ other humans as beasts of burden, or factory machines on an industrial scale, and still profess Christian values it was necessary to dehumanize them. They had to be seen as deserving slavery because they weren&#039;t real people.  And race was a way of easily visualizing and identifying suitable candidates.  In the writings of antiquity, you rarely hear the race of a person mentioned, it simply didn&#039;t matter; it was ethnic, class, tribal and family connections that were important.  If a Roman had a Greek slave, he didn&#039;t think all Greeks deserved to be slaves, or that Romans shouldn&#039;t be enslaved at all. 

The slave markets of the ancient world were fully integrated, all races, nations and religions contributed to them.  It was religion that championed individual virtue and sin that made them segregated by race.  Its OK to enslave blacks, just look at them.  You can SEE they are slaves. They deserve it.  Its in their blood.

What I still can&#039;t figure out is how slavery changed in the New World.  The Spanish civilization of Latin America employed slaves just as brutally as the Anglos in the North, but when it was finally outlawed those societies accepted it.  There was still social racism, but not the sort of malice and hatred shown to the Negro in North America.  Why this should be is not clear.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The melting pot and ignorance of the world certainly have a lot to do with it,  but I also think it goes back a lot further than that.  I think it originates with the adoption of slavery by Monotheistic cultures.  The teachings of Christianity and Islam, with their emphasis on individual moral responsibility, made slavery incompatible with religious doctrine. In the pagan world, a slave was a prisoner, someone paying the price for committing a crime, or losing a war.  The slave was not inferior, or subhuman, he might have been royalty or an aristocrat prior to his enslavement. In fact, highly talented slaves were recognized as valuable assets, they could run your farm, or design your buildings, or manage your business. Many were enslaved for their math and literacy skills, becoming teachers and accountants. Many were employed as scribes, physicians, counselors and consultants.  They were slaves (and their children) because they had lost a war or committed a crime, not because they were subhuman creatures.  Slavery was something that happened to them, not something they were.  Their children automatically were slaves too, a concept natural to tribe and family oriented pagan cultures of the ancient world, but antithetical to the more individual oriented societies of the medieval world.</p>
<p>But Christianity and Islam taught all humans had rights and dignity in the eyes of god, and it was wrong to treat them as property.  In order to employ other humans as beasts of burden, or factory machines on an industrial scale, and still profess Christian values it was necessary to dehumanize them. They had to be seen as deserving slavery because they weren&#8217;t real people.  And race was a way of easily visualizing and identifying suitable candidates.  In the writings of antiquity, you rarely hear the race of a person mentioned, it simply didn&#8217;t matter; it was ethnic, class, tribal and family connections that were important.  If a Roman had a Greek slave, he didn&#8217;t think all Greeks deserved to be slaves, or that Romans shouldn&#8217;t be enslaved at all. </p>
<p>The slave markets of the ancient world were fully integrated, all races, nations and religions contributed to them.  It was religion that championed individual virtue and sin that made them segregated by race.  Its OK to enslave blacks, just look at them.  You can SEE they are slaves. They deserve it.  Its in their blood.</p>
<p>What I still can&#8217;t figure out is how slavery changed in the New World.  The Spanish civilization of Latin America employed slaves just as brutally as the Anglos in the North, but when it was finally outlawed those societies accepted it.  There was still social racism, but not the sort of malice and hatred shown to the Negro in North America.  Why this should be is not clear.</p>
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		<title>By: BuckGalaxy</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52096</link>
		<dc:creator>BuckGalaxy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Jul 2023 00:40:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://habitablezone.com/?p=100269#comment-52096</guid>
		<description>Kind of makes sense since &quot;Hispanic&quot; references spanish.  Latino references all of Latin America.  Whatever.

I found the Expanse post you made interesting when he described race in that show.  Race had evolved into earthers, martians and belters, regardless of traditional racial descriptions.  Interesting point on how Americans see race:  Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, etc are seen as the asian/oriental race, but they see themselves as different races.  Anyone white is the white race, but in Europe many view southern and eastern europeans as diffent races than northern europeans. Middle Eastern people are looked at as the same but Arabs and Persians feel very differently.  Blacks in Africa have deep and extreme hostility toward people from different tribal backgrounds. Not really sure how Latin Americans view one another overall, but to most Americans they are all the same south of the Rio Grande.  I think these simplistic racial categories are a combination of America&#039;s melting pot background and basic ignorance of the rest of the world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kind of makes sense since &#8220;Hispanic&#8221; references spanish.  Latino references all of Latin America.  Whatever.</p>
<p>I found the Expanse post you made interesting when he described race in that show.  Race had evolved into earthers, martians and belters, regardless of traditional racial descriptions.  Interesting point on how Americans see race:  Chinese, Japanese, Koreans, etc are seen as the asian/oriental race, but they see themselves as different races.  Anyone white is the white race, but in Europe many view southern and eastern europeans as diffent races than northern europeans. Middle Eastern people are looked at as the same but Arabs and Persians feel very differently.  Blacks in Africa have deep and extreme hostility toward people from different tribal backgrounds. Not really sure how Latin Americans view one another overall, but to most Americans they are all the same south of the Rio Grande.  I think these simplistic racial categories are a combination of America&#8217;s melting pot background and basic ignorance of the rest of the world.</p>
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		<title>By: ER</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52095</link>
		<dc:creator>ER</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Jul 2023 12:41:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://habitablezone.com/?p=100269#comment-52095</guid>
		<description>but having grown up in a Cuban household in a Cuban-American immigrant community, where both &#039;Hispano(a)&#039; and &#039;Latino(a)&#039; were used interchangeably to refer to people like us, I never once heard that distinction being drawn.  It wasn&#039;t until American Liberals, eager to show how unbiased and democratic they were, started using these terms (and criticizing others for misusing them) that any attention was brought to them. And until quite recently, I NEVER, EVER heard anyone say &#039;Latinx&#039;.

I&#039;m of Cuban heritage (all four of my grandparents were from the old country) and I have kept the culture and language of that nation.  I also consider myself a political Liberal, as how that term is understood in contemporary American usage. But to be reminded by some gringo do-gooder how I should be referring to myself is really patronizing and insulting.

I&#039;m not slamming you personally, Buck; what you say is certainly correct--technically.  But this type of linguistic bullying does no one any good, and does nothing to eliminate bias and prejudice. It just makes these limousine liberals feel better about themselves at my expense, without actually doing anything worthwhile for marginalized communities. In a way, it is itself nothing but a subtle form of racism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>but having grown up in a Cuban household in a Cuban-American immigrant community, where both &#8216;Hispano(a)&#8217; and &#8216;Latino(a)&#8217; were used interchangeably to refer to people like us, I never once heard that distinction being drawn.  It wasn&#8217;t until American Liberals, eager to show how unbiased and democratic they were, started using these terms (and criticizing others for misusing them) that any attention was brought to them. And until quite recently, I NEVER, EVER heard anyone say &#8216;Latinx&#8217;.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m of Cuban heritage (all four of my grandparents were from the old country) and I have kept the culture and language of that nation.  I also consider myself a political Liberal, as how that term is understood in contemporary American usage. But to be reminded by some gringo do-gooder how I should be referring to myself is really patronizing and insulting.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not slamming you personally, Buck; what you say is certainly correct&#8211;technically.  But this type of linguistic bullying does no one any good, and does nothing to eliminate bias and prejudice. It just makes these limousine liberals feel better about themselves at my expense, without actually doing anything worthwhile for marginalized communities. In a way, it is itself nothing but a subtle form of racism.</p>
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		<title>By: BuckGalaxy</title>
		<link>https://habitablezone.com/2023/07/17/not-woke-enough-for-you/#comment-52094</link>
		<dc:creator>BuckGalaxy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Jul 2023 05:57:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://habitablezone.com/?p=100269#comment-52094</guid>
		<description>From what i remember way back, Hispanic refers to all spanish speaking people including from Spain, not just the Americas.  But not Brazil of course which speaks Portugese.  Latino, latina, latinx would refer to all people from Latin America but not spainish or portugese speaking people from other parts of the world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From what i remember way back, Hispanic refers to all spanish speaking people including from Spain, not just the Americas.  But not Brazil of course which speaks Portugese.  Latino, latina, latinx would refer to all people from Latin America but not spainish or portugese speaking people from other parts of the world.</p>
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